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Hello, 

 

  I was playing on your TTT server when I was banned for ghosting, which was strange because there was no evidence to support this. Then mod SpicyYeti said in-game that he forced my microphone on and heard that I was ghosting. This is illegal in the United States. I have the replay and I could press charges against Joseph Topacio (SpicyYeti) as he is breaking california state law and federal law by recording my audio device without my knowledge. 

 

 I would recommend deleting whatever plugin you are using to force microphones.

 

Unless you specifically notify the player that their voice communication is being monitored you are stepping into the realm of 4th Amendment violation. (Protection againt unlawful search and seizure)

This has extended into unknowing/unwilling video/audio capture of people in their personal homes.

Edited by John34

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Hello, 

 

  I was playing on your TTT server when I was banned for ghosting, which was strange because there was no evidence to support this. Then mod SpicyYeti said in-game that he forced my microphone on and heard that I was ghosting. This is illegal in the United States. I have the replay and I could press charges against Joseph Topacio (SpicyYeti) as he is breaking california state law and federal law by recording my audio device without my knowledge. 

 

 I would recommend deleting whatever plugin you are using to force microphones.

 

Unless you specifically notify the player that their voice communication is being monitored you are stepping into the realm of 4th Amendment violation. (Protection againt unlawful search and seizure)

 

This has extended into unknowing/unwilling video/audio capture of people in their personal homes.

 

Would love to know what "plugin" allows this because none of these are allowed on our servers (as we abide to all game server policies). Please provide your replay video so we can further investigate this. 

 

Now if there was something that sent a notice notifying you regarding your microphone being monitored, then this would be voided, but regardless, I agree with your statement. So once again, please provide your replay to any of the Administrators, or myself, and we can further look into this.

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when your microphone is activated, it displays on your screen.. so..

 

Does not justify us forcing the client to turn their mic on without the client knowing. 

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Please send me the replay or whatever proof you have of this claim to me via PM for review.

 

 

The below is provided for information only. It is based on various things I've read over the years. Part or all of it may be incorrect and I make no claims to it's accuracy.

 

There is no US Federal Law that limits who can record what, that is a power left to the States (hence why some states are one-party and others are two-party).

 

To my knowledge, what you described isn't possible. Although, I'm not familiar with GMod plugins, so I can't be 100% sure on that (if it is possible, then it is definitely not something we intentionally have installed). There has been times in the past on servers I been playing on that the Admins will do whatever (including lying or making things up) to get people to confess to wrongdoings.

 

Also, Video Game Public Servers fall under the realm of Public Spaces. If someone on the server were recording their play-through, they do not need consent from everyone in that server to do so as there is no reasonable expectation of privacy in public spaces.

 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

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The server has a Staff command that allows for us to turn a person's mic on without them knowing. Essentially someone on the server would have to press 'X' to speak through the mic, but the 'MicOn'(whatever the name is) command allows us to turn it on for them and hear whether or not they are Ghosting with their friends on the server.

 

However to my knowledge this doesn't record anything. Also activating the command shows up on the top of the screen that you are talking in voice chat. 

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Kyledozer, thanks for acknowledging the existence of the command. The ultimate problem is not whether it is used to record someone but that it can be classified as an invasion of privacy and/or wiretapping/eavesdropping. As such, I'm working on disabling that command without disabling the rest of the plugin.

 

 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

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Kyledozer, thanks for acknowledging the existence of the command. The ultimate problem is not whether it is used to record someone but that it can be classified as an invasion of privacy and/or wiretapping/eavesdropping. As such, I'm working on disabling that command without disabling the rest of the plugin.

 

 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

Don't worry I understand what you are saying. Just thought I'd try to clarify exactly what the command was for anyone who wasn't aware.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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playing on and moderating ttt servers has shown me how useful this command is and i cant really explain it to anyone who has not been on a server attempting to get evidence for ghosting in the pre-ban process how this is. I have done some reaserch on the matter and I would propose a way to get to common ground.... Create a join hook that gives a message to the players along the lines of "Notice: By joining this server, you consent to having your microphone monitored" this way it does not violate any laws and if they dont like it they can chose to leave. and staff should only use it as a last resort. that is just my opinion.

 

 

                                                                                             - FRED

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playing on and moderating ttt servers has shown me how useful this command is and i cant really explain it to anyone who has not been on a server attempting to get evidence for ghosting in the pre-ban process how this is. I have done some reaserch on the matter and I would propose a way to get to common ground.... Create a join hook that gives a message to the players along the lines of "Notice: By joining this server, you consent to having your microphone monitored" this way it does not violate any laws and if they dont like it they can chose to leave. and staff should only use it as a last resort. that is just my opinion.

 

 

                                                                                             - FRED

Shouldn't be used in general. Still a violation of privacy. I'm sure there are other methods to see if users are ghosting without using this plugin

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Not gonna lie, I just lost a little faith.

How so? Because we have to comply with various laws? I'm willing to let it stay as long as someone creates a script that requires people to type a command to accept it. They must use the command every single time they join, there will be no saving the acceptance.

 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

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You can get evidence of ghosting without this command however without it it takes way longer and you have to base your stance off of evidence that is less than substantial which will only equal more people feeling they where banned incorrectly with a higher rate of actual "bad bans" ghosters are smart and will play it cool leaving relatively no trace. This will make the process harder on the staff that play on the Gmod server and to the people who mist look into and moderate the reports on this forum. As for the whole breaking the law part I can not give you official evidence, as I am not a lawyer, however I have seen this command on most every server I have played on and seen post much like these complaining about it and based off the responses I have seen I have picked up an over all gist on the matter, by joining our servers they are giving us the allowance to use commands such as this one should they not listen to our rules as a way of enforcing. This plugin is not hacking them or anything of the sort it is merely a server side lua file that allows us to converse with the targets computer in the same way that the crash command can crash a players game through the server. Hope this helped

 

 

-fred

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Fred, this command is actually forcing the player to use the Client command +voicerecord and -voicerecord. The client crashing command probably works in the same eay as well, I have not looked into such command. Historically, we have been against plugins that execute any commands on the Client without their knowledge (amx_exec for example). If we put up a notice on the server that we can guarantee the Client sees and has time to react to it before the command is used on them, then we can be in the clear by the law. I wish to take the notice a step further and require them to actually acknowledge that they have seen the notice, but it is not required by the law to my knowledge.

 

Now, we could already have a notice somewhere and just need to make it more visible, I'm not sure as I don't play on the servers.

 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

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In a previous reply I gave a possible solution of a join hook much like the motd but instead of close more like I have seen this message or I agree to this something along the lines

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In a previous reply I gave a possible solution of a join hook much like the motd but instead of close more like I have seen this message or I agree to this something along the lines

I see what you're saying since I have found the script and the alternative someone else posted to acknowledge it (and the message being sent doesn't solve it. They must comply to it. If they don't, we give them the chance to stay without forcing them to accept to it). This is still wrong. Don't want anyone tapping into my messages/mic while I am unaware or because I joined the server. This once became a problem in the other games and was shutdown with updates presented by Valve (which almost removed the whole ability to use amxmodx/sourcemod in these games until some administrators and moderators argued and agreed to some terms and conditions).

 

I know there was solution for amxx/sourcemod where the game would check the clients id and see if their friends were on the same server. Not that it'll make things easier, BUT its a safer alternative and could help

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